3 Day ban appeal. Bellymaster

Byond Account:bellymaster
Character Name(s):Random
Discord Name (ie: Name#1234):gland#5398
Round ID of Ban:13252
Ban Message (Gyazo/imgur or copy and paste):https://gyazo.com/662574b421e8e53843a0cf6972185c8f
State your appeal:I was playing chemist. I was setting up bulk meds in the chem factory, while another player attempted to build...something. Not having much time, as chem factories take quite a bit of effort to build, I was doing my best to work around the player. I attempted to work around him. He began asking me, instead of mentor help "how to place pipe." or some such. Not wanting to waste time that could be spent building my chem factory I continued on, until the player began to unscrew my pipes. He then began to take my pipes apart with a wrench, then dragging them off. I then told him to stop, two or three times. After asking him to stop multiple times, after he removed multiple pipes, and threatened to continue removing pipes if I didnt "tell him how to place pipe" I decided to hit the player a few times with a wrench. After striking them with a wrench, the player proceeded to acquire a toolbox, beating me in to hardcrit with it, then stripping me of my pda and jumpsuit, taking the items, and dragging me to med bay. I ahelped, to which the admin said "you should not have escalated to that point" to which I went SSD for the round. Yes I suppose that I could have been more understanding of the other player, but realistically that player should have looked for a guide, or mentor helped. Even more likely however, considering they knew that toolbox was the best item in the area to kill someone, knew how to hotkey grab items and unanchor items from the floor, they were actively griefing my attempt to build a factory. I am requesting an unban because.

A. My actions did not impact the other players round in any major way. They still had all necessary items and access to proceed with their round.
B. A three day ban for hitting someone for 50 brute damage seems quite excessive. I have complied with all my prior notes and requests from admins, I changed my names when requested, and have not intentionally done anything that could be construed as low effort, valid hunting, or general LRP/grief if I absolutely can avoid it. A three day ban in this situation seems quite excessive, considering that a player that may or may not be a troll, for their general knowledge of the game, ban baited me while griefing me.
C. You can ask mentors, I frequent their inbox in most rounds, I have tried to learn as much about this game and etiquette. I have not griefed recently, outside of a PDA bomb grief, that was not intention. I have tried to play properly in every game, and I try to make the best experience for everyone else that I can, my goal every round is to do the best to help the station in my role as possible, and create as much content for everyone to enjoy every round. Had I known doing 50 brute or so to a new player would net me a ban for my whole weekend, I would have just went SSD.


Also, for clarifications sake, it was not that “i didnt agree with his chemistry setup” I didnt know nor care what he was building. The other player was actively unbuilding mine, intentionally. I attacked them yes, and they robusted my ass in to the ground.


And I mean, at the end of the day, I would say that I have made alot of mistakes in the way I handle things, yes. I have done bad stuff, and it is all in the admin notes. But the frequency of the bad shit has gone down dramatically, I really enjoy playing on the server, and I like to think that in general, I am helpful more than I hinder people. I do my best to follow space law when I play sec, I build chem factories when I am a chemist, I grind out as much minerals as I can when I am a miner, I dont really think that making someone get a libital 3u patch to heal the handful of wrench hits that I gave them deserving of a three day ban.

Yes, in response to the statement in the ban reasoning, I guess I should have tried to help, but I have only really been doing plumbing for a couple hours now, and the amount of effort it would take to explain how it works to someone that doesnt know how to put down items would be quite a bit, if I could really explain it to them. Considering they didnt know how to mentorhelp, I really doubt I could have explained much to the player.

That and the fact that they actively deconstructed my buildings was not a good motivator for me to help them, either.

1). Escalation resulting in murder is only acceptable within reason. If your life is in danger, you can always fight back lethally, or if a conflict with the other player has lasted throughout the round with multiple fights. In most cases, fights end when one party enters critical condition or is otherwise incapacitated. Theft, break-ins, demotions, destruction of property, getting pranked and other inconveniences are not reasons to murder another player or put them into a life or death situation. Ask what a rational person would do and act accordingly.

1.1. Expect to receive the same kind of treatment and escalation that you give out.

  • 1.2. If the other party during an altercation dies or is seriously injured, work to get them healed or revived.

2). If you act like an antagonist, expect to be treated like one and be held liable for your actions both IC and by admins.

3). Over-escalation of fights is also unacceptable. Over-escalation is, in short, doing more damage to someone than is required to resolve an issue or using violence instead of words to solve an issue.

Examples being:

  • Killing someone during a dangerous fight when they could be placed into crit and healed or ignoring the opportunity to use non-lethal force when available.
  • Placing someone someplace they will surely die, like disposals when crit, space, in shuttle landing zones or other gibbers.
  • Delimbing someone for doing minimal damage to you.
  • Breaking into a department and attacking someone when they try to remove you from the department instead of asking for what is needed.

3.1). While using lethal force is allowed in some cases of self-defense, actions that jeopardize the lives of other players or could cause massive damage to the station (e.g. max caps) is considered over escalation, and you will be held accountable for deaths that occur due to negligent behavior. This rule applies when committing acts that will likely cause mass casualties to eliminate antagonists.*

Under this ruleset, I do not believe that I cause sufficient harm to the counterparty to warrant a ban. I neither crit them, nor did I use any lethal force that could be deemed sufficiently lethal. My attacks were primarily to get the counterparty to leave me alone. The counter party followed rules, perhaps a bit less so, as I believe, if memory serves me, that I was stripped of my PDA while in crit, and sent to med bay. I had attempted to use words, telling the other party to stop, and they did not.

4). Crew members are expected to communicate requests and exhaust all other options (e.g. PDAing department heads, contacting the AI, and using departmental request consoles) before breaking into any department. See Core Rule 1.6

As this altercation occurred in the chem factory, I had, prior, asked the CMO, about two or three minutes before, to come and have the chemist stop harassing me. The CMO did nothing, and no other head really exists to moderate our department.

5). Crew members should be considerate of their co-workers and avoid intentionally making projects more difficult for them in shared space. This includes things like making significant changes to the piping in atmospherics without consulting other atmos techs, stealing other roboticists’ mechs, or interrupting players who are using the autholathe.

Under this rule, as the counterparty was actively making my attempts to construct my factory unsuccessful(wrenching up pipes that I had laid, preventing chemicals from flowing) I would believe that some form of escalation or exterior actions would be reasonable. The coworker made no reasonable attempts to ask what I was doing, or offer to aid, and instead, while I was working, began to actively undo my work. While violence from my part was ineffective, breaking rules because the player lacks knowledge seems to go against server rules.

Appeal accepted. At least on your part, the escalation was within the rules, even if you were a bit rude. I’d consider this an IC situation in regards to you, so I will be removing the ban. Though, next time just try to settle this in a nonviolent way and you probably won’t get killed.